Democracy Paradox

We don’t need to export ideas about freedom and democracy because those ideas are already really popular around the world.
Michael McFaul
Why do some powerful countries become adversaries while others remain enduring allies? Michael McFaul joins Justin Kempf on Democracy Paradox to discuss his book, Autocrats vs. Democrats: China, Russia, America, and the New Global Disorder. Drawing on his experience as a democracy scholar and former US ambassador to Russia, McFaul explores how political systems and individual leaders shape the exercise of power. Their conversation examines China’s and Russia’s different ambitions, the threat Ukraine’s democratic development poses to Vladimir Putin, and how democratic erosion at home affects America’s influence abroad.
Michael McFaul is the Ken Olivier and Angela Nomellini Professor of International Studies in Political Science, Senior Fellow at the Freeman Spogli Institute for International Studies, and the Peter and Helen Bing Senior Fellow at the Hoover Institution, all at Stanford University. He is the author of From Cold War to Hot Peace: An American Ambassador in Putin’s Russia and Autocrats vs. Democrats: China, Russia, America, and the New Global Disorder.
The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame. 
Read the full transcript here.
Key Highlights
Introduction - 0:20
The Cocktail of Power and Dictatorship - 3:33
Shades of Gray - 14:50
Rupture - 28:06
Democracy at Home - 39:03
Links
Learn more about Michael McFaul.
Learn more about his book Autocrats vs. Democrats: China, Russia, America, and the New Global Disorder (Harper Collins).
Learn more about the Kellogg Institute
Apes of the State created all Music
Email comments or questions to jkempf@democracyparadox.com
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If we want people to support democratic capitalism, it has to be a kind of democratic capitalism that delivers for most people, and we haven't had that.
Ian Shapiro
What went wrong after the Cold War – and what can democracies learn from the opportunities they missed? Ian Shapiro, Sterling Professor of Political Science and Global Affairs at Yale University and author of After the Fall: From the End of History to the Crisis of Democracy, How Politicians Broke Our World, joins Democracy Paradox to examine how political choices helped shape today’s populist backlash. Shapiro argues that center-left parties too readily accepted the neoliberal economic consensus, leaving many voters economically insecure and politically alienated. He and Justin Kempf also explore what a new economic model might require as democracies confront artificial intelligence, demographic change, immigration, and the transformation of work – and why, despite democracy’s vulnerabilities, Shapiro sees reasons for hope.
Ian Shapiro is the Sterling Professor of Political Science at Yale University. His latest book is After the Fall: From the End of History to the Crisis of Democracy, How Politicians Broke Our World. 
The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame. 
Read the full transcript here.
Key Highlights
Introduction - 0:20
The Left's Preemptive Capitulation - 2:21
A Dollar Short, a Day Late - 14:52
Right on Politics, Wrong on Math - 25:19
The Next Turning Point - 39:38

Links
Learn more about Ian Shapiro.
Learn more about his book After the Fall: From the End of History to the Crisis of Democracy, How Politicians Broke Our World (Basic Books).
Learn more about the Kellogg Institute.
Apes of the State created all Music
Email comments or questions to jkempf@democracyparadox.com
Support the show

The irony of democratic backsliding is a lot of these things are pitched to people and understood by people as actually pro-democratic.
Noam Lupu
Support for democracy is rising across the Americas after more than a decade of decline, but what kind of democracy do citizens actually want? Noam Lupu, director of Vanderbilt University’s Center for Global Democracy and LAPOP Lab, joins Justin Kempf to discuss findings from the latest AmericasBarometer and Pulse of Democracy. They explore why better economic and security conditions may be strengthening democratic support, even as distrust of political institutions persists; how citizens can embrace democracy while supporting illiberal leaders; and what attitudes toward representation, inequality, generational change, and political polarization reveal about the future of democracy across the region.
Noam Lupu is the Gertrude Conaway Vanderbilt Professor of Political Science at Vanderbilt University and Director of the Center for Global Democracy and LAPOP Lab. 
The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame. 
Read the full transcript here.
Key Highlights
Introduction - 0:20
Is Democracy Delivering? - 2:36
The Illiberal Bargain - 9:56
The Outliers: Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay - 19:56
Whose Democracy Is It? - 29:31
Links
Learn more about Noam Lupu.
Learn more about the AmericasBarometer survey. 
Read the Pulse of Democracy 2026 report. 
Learn more about the Kellogg Institute.
Apes of the State created all Music
Email comments or questions to jkempf@democracyparadox.com
Support the show

There was an assumption that influence could only run one direction... but influence could run the other direction as well.
Alexander Cooley
Authoritarian governments are exercising growing influence not only within their own borders but across the institutions, markets, and organizations that shape global life. Alexander Cooley and Alexander Dukalskis, authors of Dictating the Agenda: The Authoritarian Resurgence in World Politics, join Justin Kempf to examine how authoritarian states have learned to reshape the liberal international order for illiberal ends. They discuss cooperation among autocracies, the growing economic power behind authoritarian influence, pressure on corporations and universities, and what these changes mean for liberalism, democracy, and the future of global governance.
Alexander Cooley is the Claire Tow Professor of Political Science and Vice Provost for Research and Academic Centers at Barnard College, Columbia University. Alexander Dukalskis associate professor in the School of Politics & International Relations at University College Dublin. They are the authors of the recent book Dictating the Agenda: The Authoritarian Resurgence in World Politics.  
The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame. 
Read the full transcript here.
Key Highlights
Introduction - 0:20
Liberalism, Not Democracy - 3:18
The Autocratic Axis -  15:01
Profits Over Principles - 28:20
What Comes After Liberalism? - 38:47
Links
Learn more about Alexander Cooley.
Learn more about Alexander Dukalskis.
Learn more about their book Dictating the Agenda: The Authoritarian Resurgence in World Politics (Oxford University Press, 2026)
Learn more about the Kellogg Institute
Apes of the State created all Music
Email comments or questions to jkempf@democracyparadox.com
Support the show

We barely disagree with each other, but we can't stand one another's party. 
Suzanne Mettler
Suzanne Mettler is the John L. Senior Professor of American Institutions at Cornell University. She is the coauthor of Four Threats with Robert Lieberman and Rural Versus Urban: The Growing Divide that Threatens Democracy coauthored with Trevor Brown. 
The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame. 
Read the full transcript here.
Key Highlights
Introduction - 0:20
From a 2-Point Gap to a 20-Point Chasm - 3:10
The NAFTA Betrayal Democrats Never Escaped - 15:01
Why Are You Kowtowing to These Elites? - 23:31
Power Without Prosperity - 34:35
Links
Read the book Rural Versus Urban: The Growing Divide That Threatens Democracy
Learn more about Suzanne Mettler
Learn more about the Kellogg Institute
Apes of the State created all Music
Email comments or questions to jkempf@democracyparadox.com

Support the show